Semi official cool old Indy car pics thread

**indyrjc** · 12-03-2009 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by LittleFauss

....., not only would it have been on Goodyear's, it wouldn't have had the old, obsolete external water pipe running up to the front of the car. So maybe it is one of Aggie's and possibly little Bruce Walkup steering the car? Either way, both he and Jigger Sirois missed the show if that was the car......

Fauss, could that photo be from 1973? And the tire painted on the cowl is also a clue. Is it possible that this is one of the 1973 Cobre Tire cars early in the month before they got their final paint job? The painted tire might make sense since Bob Fletcher was a Firestone dealer. And from behind that almost looks like Jimmy Caruthers steering the car as it's being pushed.

**DaveL** · 12-03-2009 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by indyrjc

Fauss, could that photo be from 1973? And the tire painted on the cowl is also a clue. Is it possible that this is one of the 1973 Cobre Tire cars early in the month before they got their final paint job? The painted tire might make sense since Bob Fletcher was a Firestone dealer. And from behind that almost looks like Jimmy Caruthers steering the car as it's being pushed.

It's unlikely. The Fletcher cars were gold, black and white. A car wouldn't have decals before the car is painted. It's also an older model car (pre-1972) and Fletcher had new cars in '73.

Looking at the team jackets, I'd guess it's from '72 and probably one of the old Watson team cars. Rick Muther DNQ'd in one of the Vivitar cars that year and that very well could be him and his car.

**ZOOOM** · 12-03-2009 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Gokart Mozart

MichaelP -

There are vent tubes that lead out of both fuel cells and up into the roll hoop. From there they regroup and lead into the down tube that goes from the roll hoop to the rear part of the engine. At the bottom of the down tube there is another hose that runs out behind the engine to allow said fuel vapors to run clear of the engine bay.

Hope that helps!

Respectfully Yours,

Jacques

And I suppose just because you happen to OWN two Eagles.... we are supposed to BELIEVE you....

ZOOOM

**timc1** · 12-03-2009 08:23 PM

Hi... Does anyone have pictures of Mike Mosley in the #36 Theodore Racing Gurney Eagle Indy Car from the 1979 season.
ANY pictures would be greatly appreciated.
I've searched everywhere and can only find 1 picture (shown here)

**Calhoun** · 12-03-2009 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by timc1

Hi... Does anyone have pictures of Mike Mosley in the #36 Theodore Racing Gurney Eagle Indy Car from the 1979 season.

Just this one from the season opener at Phoenix. I think I scanned this from Racing Pictorial.

**timc1** · 12-03-2009 09:41 PM

Thank you!!! I've been looking for pics like this for years!!! That's awesome!!!

**Rick Jones** · 12-03-2009 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by Ovalmeister

Steve Krisiloff?

This is Krisiloff and the Grant King Kingfish copy of the 1971 McLaren.

**Rick Jones** · 12-03-2009 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by Ovalmeister

Swede Savage?

This is Savage in a modified Eagle, and Michner Industries was the sponsor. He was Rutherford's team mate and both had a miserable race day with engine woes. Rutherford drove a modified Brabham. If I remember correctly, both cars had great downforce due to a very unique front end design. This front end was basically a series of wings in front of the radiator but it created a great deal of drag which quickly caused the engines to blow.

**Rick Jones** · 12-03-2009 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by sneva33

Teo Fabi 1990 Mid Ohio

This car was one of the most beautifully designed Indycars of all time in my opinion. It still looks fast sitting still in the museum!

**timc1** · 12-03-2009 10:21 PM

I've never seen so many great indy car pictures in one place!!!! This is the best thread ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

**Ovalmeister** · 12-03-2009 10:59 PM

Hey guys, thanks for the photo ID's! Now I can label the backs of the photos. I have more like these, didn't want to flood the thread all at once. I'll try to scan some more tomorrow. Thanks again!

David.

**KevMcNJ** · 12-03-2009 11:13 PM

I think its entertaining to look at some of the people working on the cars in some of the pics taken at IMS and other tracks in the 70s.

I mean some of them are dressed so shabby that they would be told to go home and change if they were working at a 15 minute oil change shop these days

Its kind of quaint actually No need to have 35 mechanics all in $2000 Nomex suits. Just a couple old coots with a $20 Craftsman tool box and and a pack of Pall Malls

**DaveL** · 12-03-2009 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by KevMcNJ

Its kind of quaint actually No need to have 35 mechanics all in $2000 Nomex suits. Just a couple old coots with a $20 Craftsman tool box and and a pack of Pall Malls

No so quaint when you look at attrition rates and how many cars didn't make it past ten laps of the race.

Janet Guthrie's book touches on this. The Vollstedt team simply didn't have enough qualified mechanics to do all of the work necessary to prepare the car. If one thing was looked after, another was neglected. Small wonder the car spent more time in the garage than on the track because something was always breaking down from lack of proper attention from the too small crew.

**tnindyman** · 12-04-2009 08:20 AM

Originally Posted by Rick Jones

This car was one of the most beautifully designed Indycars of all time in my opinion. It still looks fast sitting still in the museum!

DITTO...I was wondering how many here witnessed this little guy's pole run at INDY?

**indyrjc** · 12-04-2009 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by DaveL

No so quaint when you look at attrition rates and how many cars didn't make it past ten laps of the race.

Janet Guthrie's book touches on this. The Vollstedt team simply didn't have enough qualified mechanics to do all of the work necessary to prepare the car. If one thing was looked after, another was neglected. Small wonder the car spent more time in the garage than on the track because something was always breaking down from lack of proper attention from the too small crew.

Very true and most of it was because there just wasn't any money in racing. Sponsorships weren't really all that much. A few teams (Penske, Patrick, Foyt, McLaren, etc.) had funding comparable (relatively) to what top teams have today and they were the ones that were in real contention for the wins. On the other hand these smaller teams were also pretty easy for an unknown driver to get a ride with; and they didn't bring money. Guys like Tom Sneva and Rick Mears took some pretty inferior cars and made them go fast enough to get themselves into really good rides. That just doesn't happen today.

Getting back to the mechanical side if you could get an older car to Indianapolis back then sometimes your expenses weren't all that much after your initial investment. Tires, fuel, oil, racing grade bolts, brakes, etc. were all provided free of charge to entered cars by accessory companies so small teams loved that. And you got to use your garage at the Speedway all year long so that was the equivalent of free rent and many smaller teams took advantage of this. If you could keep your car off of the wall and it was rolling on all four wheels when the Month of May was over you were still in good shape. And every year a bunch of these smaller teams got their cars qualified and got some decent money for just starting. And that paid the drivers as well since they weren't drawing salaries either. Most of them were making personal appearances around town all month in return for meal tickets and pocket change. Racing was never cheap but a lot of owners and drivers got to go racing for a whole lot less money (even adjusted for the decling dollar) than it takes today. And even though a lot of the teams couldn't afford brand new parts (many used cast off or worn out engine and gearbox pieces) comparatively they didn't really run that much slower than most of the teams that make up the IRL today. These guys were mostly going racing with one hand tied behind their back but they did it for the love of racing and just competing. What's amazing today is that even though the smaller teams all have huge budgets, big crew rosters, and identical cars they still can't come close to running with the two or three dominant teams. At least in the past there were more legitimate reasons for why they weren't going to win.

**Stand A** · 12-04-2009 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by tnindyman

DITTO...I was wondering how many here witnessed this little guy's pole run at INDY?

I was in the 5th grade, but I was there.

**tnindyman** · 12-04-2009 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by Ovalmeister

Driver?

Is that Grant King at the rear wing? Maybe Jackie Howerton kneeling behind the rear wing?

Wasn't this car the "Kingfish" McClaren copy built by Grant King? He also did an Eagle copy, IIRC.

**Gokart Mozart** · 12-04-2009 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by ZOOOM

And I suppose just because you happen to OWN two Eagles.... we are supposed to BELIEVE you....

ZOOOM

Actually, I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night, I don't even know what an Eagle is.

Cheers,

Jacques

**mwphoto** · 12-04-2009 10:19 AM

A few more of the March 90P/Porsche from 1990

John Andretti at Detroit

at Road America

at MIS

**MichaelP** · 12-04-2009 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by tnindyman

Wasn't this car the "Kingfish" McClaren copy built by Grant King? He also did an Eagle copy, IIRC.

He pretty much copied everything at one time or another.

Of course he wasn't the only one - the Penske PC-5 was an exact copy of the McLaren that Sneva drove in 1977 when he cracked 200mph.

**MichaelP** · 12-04-2009 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by DaveL

Janet Guthrie's book touches on this. The Vollstedt team simply didn't have enough qualified mechanics to do all of the work necessary to prepare the car. If one thing was looked after, another was neglected. Small wonder the car spent more time in the garage than on the track because something was always breaking down from lack of proper attention from the too small crew.

Say what you will about Janet, but I gained a ton of respect for her after reading her book. Not that I didn't have any before, but crap she had to drive made her achievements even greater IMO. I was particularly impressed with her 6th place at Bristol... in a superspeedway car.

**DaveL** · 12-04-2009 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by MichaelP

Say what you will about Janet, but I gained a ton of respect for her after reading her book. Not that I didn't have any before, but crap she had to drive made her achievements even greater IMO. I was particularly impressed with her 6th place at Bristol... in a superspeedway car.

I'll never say a bad word about Janet. She is and always will be the First Lady of Racing...pure class all the way. Plus, her writing is beautiful. Her description of race day 1977 at the beginning of the book is poetry.

**flatlander_48** · 12-04-2009 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by tnindyman

Wasn't this car the "Kingfish" McClaren copy built by Grant King? He also did an Eagle copy, IIRC.

Yes, Gurney called them Chinese Eagles...

**indyrjc** · 12-04-2009 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by MichaelP

He pretty much copied everything at one time or another.

Of course he wasn't the only one - the Penske PC-5 was an exact copy of the McLaren that Sneva drove in 1977 when he cracked 200mph.

Grant also built some Kingfish "Coyote" copies (with Offies) when that chassis was running pretty strong.

**Ovalmeister** · 12-04-2009 12:52 PM

Thanks again for the help in identifying the earlier photos. Here's a few more of my older brother's shots that I need help with. Enjoy...and thanks.
David.