Supporting Oval Races

[Chris Paff]

So the road racing crowd on the Indycar board states that the oval fans need to show up and support the oval races before demanding to have more oval races on the schedule..

How about this.. We will start to show up when there is a product we want to spend our time and money on.. Most of us have zero interest in watching this group of drivers.. When you do not like or care about 90% of the drivers in the field it is kinda hard to be interested in showing up.. Nothing is going to change until the driver lineup changes.. Which is not going to happen with these car owners..

I wouldn't crow too much about the attendance at the road races.. It is not good either.. That is why there is only 3 natural road courses on the schedule..

[railroad]

Take away the government subsidies for street races and I bet they would struggle as well. Plus, it's a little easier to hop on a bus to go downtown for a street race than to drive 10 hours and pay for gas, food, hotel, etc., to see an oval.

[Chris Paff]

Take away the government subsidies for street races and I bet they would struggle as well. Plus, it's a little easier to hop on a bus to go downtown for a street race than to drive 10 hours and pay for gas, food, hotel, etc., to see an oval.

Also from my experience from this years Baltimore GP.. Street races get alot of non-racing fans who are there to hang out and are not at all interested in whats going on-track..

[SnakePitLounge]

Also from my experience from this years Baltimore GP.. Street races get alot of non-racing fans who are there to hang out and are not at all interested in whats going on-track..

Road Courses are struggling as well. I've been to Mid-Ohio the last three years and have seen a signficant delcline. Sonoma has been on life line for a while and is only keep because it's in a large market. That had an increase this year but when you're that low in attendance...increases are just mere blimps in the radar. Watkins Glen was pulled. That leaves Barber.

Like someone posted above....Street Courses without goverment funding fail...looks like Baltimore would be added to that list. Succesful street course has 25,000 people but that's consider a failure for ovals.
Bottom line it's the product....you're basically trying to sell the Soccer version of auto racing in America....where Soccer struggles. F1 Lite has failed two previous times....don't know why folks won't learn past lessons

[Joonyah]

So the road racing crowd on the Indycar board states that the oval fans need to show up and support the oval races before demanding to have more oval races on the schedule..

How about this.. We will start to show up when there is a product we want to spend our time and money on.. Most of us have zero interest in watching this group of drivers.. When you do not like or care about 90% of the drivers in the field it is kinda hard to be interested in showing up.. Nothing is going to change until the driver lineup changes.. Which is not going to happen with these car owners..

I wouldn't crow too much about the attendance at the road races.. It is not good either.. That is why there is only 3 natural road courses on the schedule..

The second paragraph means that you are inviting the removal of ovals from the schedule. You won't change the tide with that attitude.

[Chris Paff]

The second paragraph means that you are inviting the removal of ovals from the schedule. You won't change the tide with that attitude.

Sure, because the series is doing nothing to appeal to the oval racing fans out there.. Just adding ovals is not going to appeal to those fans..

So you expect oval fans just to hold their noses and show up when we dislike the product and have zero interest in the drivers.. That is the typical road racing fan expectation of oval fans..

Nothing is going to change the tide until the series starts to get serious about appealing to the oval racing fan.. Outside of supporting Bryan Clauson, Randy has done nothing to appeal to the oval fanbase..

[Disciple]

Excuse: Ovals don't draw enough people to make them worthwhile.
Reality: Whacko and inconsistent scheduling, really awful presentation, high prices, lack of promotion and a predisposition of legacy teams that have re-occupied the sport to push non-ovals have begun to take their toll on any part of a partial oval schedule.

It is sad and tragic.

Every single oval outside Indy my party attended every year has been removed. This is not to say non-ovals do not have a place. We have also attended every test, practice and race held thus far at Barber and have always had a great time.

That said, the current imbalance is utterly disgraceful.

-The Will Be Able To Save More Money In 2012 Disciple of INDYCAR

[Vasserfan]

We need more ovals. We need a 50-50 split in my opinion. We have a good group of drivers, I would rather see talented drivers than some guy who is in the car because he is an American. But I agree the series needs some more "talented" American drivers.

I believe that next year will see more ovals. We had to get rid of Vegas thsi year due to the unknown safety issues. But with more testing, I trust Randy when he says he wants more ovals. That may mean more IndyCar self promotes. I know many here raked CART and CCWS over the coals when they did self promotes, but right now, that is the only way to get New Hampshire, Milwaukee, and Vegas back on the schedule.

[Joonyah]

Sure, because the series is doing nothing to appeal to the oval racing fans out there.. Just adding ovals is not going to appeal to those fans..

So you expect oval fans just to hold their noses and show up when we dislike the product and have zero interest in the drivers.. That is the typical road racing fan expectation of oval fans..

Nothing is going to change the tide until the series starts to get serious about appealing to the oval racing fan.. Outside of supporting Bryan Clauson, Randy has done nothing to appeal to the oval fanbase..

So wait, at first you said the series is doing nothing to appeal to the oval racing fans, yet in the last paragraph you said they're doing something to appeal to the oval fanbase.

What is your argument?

And no, I'm not a road racing fan. I'm a racing fan. I could give a hoot what types of tracks they race on, my attitude is that I can't wait for the next one, bring it on.

[Chris Paff]

So wait, at first you said the series is doing nothing to appeal to the oval racing fans, yet in the last paragraph you said they're doing something to appeal to the oval fanbase.

What is your argument?

And no, I'm not a road racing fan. I'm a racing fan. I could give a hoot what types of tracks they race on, my attitude is that I can't wait for the next one, bring it on.

I am a racing fan as well but I perfer ovals by a large margin..

So if Indycar goes back to where it belongs with a 100% oval track schedule you would still support it?

[Joonyah]

I am a racing fan as well but I perfer ovals by a large margin..

So if Indycar goes back to where it belongs with a 100% oval track schedule you would still support it?

I wouldn't like 100% ovals, but I'd watch. Of course, you wouldn't do the same thing if it were all road races.

[Chris Paff]

I wouldn't like 100% ovals, but I'd watch. Of course, you wouldn't do the same thing if it were all road races.

The series would be dead is it went all road races.. It is almost there now..

[Vasserfan]

I am a racing fan as well but I perfer ovals by a large margin..

So if Indycar goes back to where it belongs with a 100% oval track schedule you would still support it?

So IndyCar belongs 100% on Ovals?

So, when AJ was winning the series championship at Riverside, that was wrong?

The history of places like Long Beach and Road America, don't belong on an IndyCar schedule?

So, are you a racing fan or just an Oval racing fan? Or just a fan if 100% Americans are racing Ovals?

[Chris Paff]

So IndyCar belongs 100% on Ovals?

So, when AJ was winning the series championship at Riverside, that was wrong?

The history of places like Long Beach and Road America, don't belong on an IndyCar schedule?

So, are you a racing fan or just an Oval racing fan? Or just a fan if 100% Americans are racing Ovals?

Indycar should be a oval racing series.. There is room for at most 1-3 road races but that is about it IMO..

Long Beach provides pretty horrible racing almost every year..

I am a racing fan that prefers oval racing.. If I want to watch road racing I watch F1 or Grand Am..

The series is never going to become popular in this country with the current driver lineup.. That is proven every single year.. It needs to have a heavy dose of talented American drivers for American racing fans to be interested..

Why do you think oval fans are leaving in droves?

[Joonyah]

Indycar should be a oval racing series.. There is room for at most 1-3 road races but that is about it IMO..

Long Beach provides pretty horrible racing almost every year..

I am a racing fan that prefers oval racing.. If I want to watch road racing I watch F1 or Grand Am..

The series is never going to become popular in this country with the current driver lineup.. That is proven every single year.. It needs to have a heavy dose of talented American drivers for American racing fans to be interested..

There were heavy doses of Americans in the late 90s in the IRL. Why did ratings go down every year?

[Chris Paff]

There were heavy doses of Americans in the late 90s in the IRL. Why did ratings go down every year?

They were competing in a split atmosphere.. The press was very pro-CART and bashed the IRL at every chance it got..

Let me ask you this.. The series got the road/street courses back and the unknown foreign road racers back.. Why hasn't the series taken off?

[Joonyah]

They were competing in a split atmosphere.. The press was very pro-CART and bashed the IRL at every chance it got..

Let me ask you this.. The series got the road/street courses back and the unknown foreign road racers back.. Why hasn't the series taken off?

Unknown foreign road racers back? Let's go back to 1995.

Fittipaldi (both)
Fabi
Gugelmin (F1)
Fernandez
Johansson (F1, drove for Ferrari and McLaren)
de Ferran
Boesel

Unknown? Really?

As for your first point, that's just a poor excuse. If the series was good, the press would've flocked to them.

And the foreign road racers might be unknown to you, but I actually look at the European ladder series every now and then. That's where the future is in road racing.

The series hasn't taken off for many reasons. We had very bad management for a long time before Bernard got in control. We had inept race control and a less than stellar commercial director. We've had the same car for 9 years that was long overdue for replacement three times over going by the 3 year cycle. We had engines that were so detuned that the cars weren't being stressed to their maximum, and it doesn't help that we were put on Versus, but they might pay off in the future.

The series tried all ovals and majority americans. It didn't work, because IndyCars in the modern era is known as a mix of ovals and road racing.

[indyrox@lith]

Also from my experience from this years Baltimore GP.. Street races get alot of non-racing fans who are there to hang out and are not at all interested in whats going on-track..

The same could be said for Indy. What's your point?

[Chris Paff]

And the foreign road racers might be unknown to you, but I actually look at the European ladder series every now and then. That's where the future is in road racing.

Your one of the handful that pays any attention to the european ladder series in this country.. So yes they are unknown and totally unmarketable in the USA..

[Chris Paff]

The same could be said for Indy. What's your point?

Those people are in the infield.. 250k are actually watching and interested in the race.. Baltimore GP had at most 25-30k in the grandstands..

[PenelopePitstop]

Also from my experience from this years Baltimore GP.. Street races get alot of non-racing fans who are there to hang out and are not at all interested in whats going on-track..

Fans come from exposure. I don't particularly enjoy city street racing, but one good side of them is that they bring the sport to a ton of people who are now potential customers.

The series needs to halve its sanctioning fees, double the number of events on the schedule, quit going to faraway lands and create a promotions team that works in liaison with each track. More races + more exposure + more fans. Chinese viewers and Brazilian fans don't help the series in long-term TV audience. And TV revenue is the lifeblood of profitable big league sports.

[Chris Paff]

The series needs to halve its sanctioning fees, double the number of events on the schedule, quit going to faraway lands and create a promotions team that works in liaison with each track. More races + more exposure + more fans. Chinese eyes and Brazil nuts don't help the series in long-term TV audience. And TV revenue is the lifeblood of profitable big league sports.

I agree 100%

[rfellows]

Unknown foreign road racers back? Let's go back to 1995.

Fittipaldi (both)
Fabi
Gugelmin (F1)
Fernandez
Johansson (F1, drove for Ferrari and McLaren)
de Ferran
Boesel

Unknown? Really?

Don't forget Tracy, Goodyear and Villeneuve. Uncle Sam has not taken us over yet!

[Joonyah]

Your one of the handful that pays any attention to the european ladder series in this country.. So yes they are unknown and totally unmarketable in the USA..

Are all foreigners unmarketable?

[Joonyah]

Don't forget Tracy, Goodyear and Villeneuve. Uncle Sam has not taken us over yet!

I consider Canada more a neighbor than a true foreign country.

[Chris Paff]

Are all foreigners unmarketable?

99% of them are.. IMO

[redmist]

Your one of the handful that pays any attention to the european ladder series in this country.. So yes they are unknown and totally unmarketable in the USA..

as opposed to the handful that pay attention to american ladder series

[Chris Paff]

as opposed to the handful that pay attention to american ladder series

Many people attend short track oval racing every Saturday night.. So it is more then a handful..

[Joonyah]

99% of them are.. IMO

My number is way down from that. People gravitated to Emmo, Tracy, Zanardi, Moore, and Mansell.

[vegasGPfan]

Many people attend short track oval racing every Saturday night.. So it is more then a handful..

hate to break it to you but even the saturday night short tracks are falling out as well with the economy hell orange show speedway in san bernadino california just closed its doors after 65 years of business because hardly anyone was showing up