Ah, the irony

[ghost]

Oh look. Another thread about how we need more Americans in IndyCar. I wonder if anything new is being discussed here?

*Reads thread*

Nope. Just the same old bickering about how we need more Americans for the series to succeed, even though there is nothing to really back that up. Not to mention there is no plan put forth by anyone to actually get more Americans into IndyCar, as if the series really has much control over who participates and who doesn't without provoking a negative media response. Nope, just another rehash of the abundance of threads that came before this one.

So your position is that the series as it is, is "successful?"

[Sea Fury]

Great american drivers from the past IRL:

Jack Miller, Scott Harrington, Buzz Calkins, Mike Groff, Johnny Parsons, Paul Durant, Joe Gosek, Billy Boat, Dan Drinan, Stan Wattles, Davy Jones, Lyn St. James, Johnny O' Conell (I still remember his big crash at Vegas 96), Jim Guthrie..

All we need is great US drivers for Indycar!!

Billy Boat and Davy Jones were good. Boat has 1 Indy car win and Jones has Le Mans, Daytona and IMSA GTP victories and a 2nd place at Indy that you don't have, "Racer."

IIRC Davy might even have won the 1996 500 had he not been Salazar'd.

[Sea Fury]

You're manufacturing an argument...
Who wanted her to leave?

You're kidding, right?

[ambig88]

So your position is that the series as it is, is "successful?"

Mind pointing out where I said that it was successful?

My position is that it's not the lack of Americans that are killing the sport. It's the lack of consistency, exposure and sponsors that are doing it. Not to mention that almost none of these threads actually include any ideas as to how to get Americans into the sport, but rather just features whining and crying about how we need more Americans.

I understand people are frustrated to see good drivers sitting on the side line when ride buyers are in a seat. But this doesn't just affect IndyCar. It affect's F1, NASCAR and other series all around the world.

[Josh Knight]

Maybe there would be more americans in F1 if Windsor and who else was involved didn't f up USF1 Team

[mstove]

MLB is still predominantly made of domestic players and if you look at the top 20 in the most recent list of jersey sales available, you'll find nearly all of them of American or Canadian birth. Albert Pujuls is the only foreign born player to even crack the top ten at fifth. In NBA jersey sales you'll also find that not a single foreign born player cracks their top ten in jersey sales despite the fact they have a large number of foreign born players including one that led the Dallas Mavericks to the championship. Both are still predominantly made up of American talent.

On the other hand 47 drivers raced or attempted to race in the entire year for IndyCar. 12 of those were Americans. So 75% of the field was composed of foreign born talent when we're talking about marketing to a country where its already been shown that the fan favorites are consistently American born. I'm not talking about the narrow sample of IndyCar fans, but much more popular sports. Add into that that a total of two races were won by American drivers and the highest an American finished was 7th in the points. That's not enough to get the interest of the average person outside of the 500.

I get your point, but the problem with this is you are comparing who is the most popular in MLB with who has done the best in IndyCar (jersey sales versus highest American finishing 7th in points). It is apples and oranges. The most popular IICS driver was still an American last year even if many here are happy to see her go.

No doubt the most popular MLB players are American born. However, more than one in 20 of the best players (your jersey sales numbers) are foreign born. Of course, the difference in MLB is that there are hundreds of players so even with a significant number of top foreign players around there are more than enough good Americans to market.

[kartracer23]

What does Eddie know?? He can't even put his neck collar on right side up.
This is in front of me on the grid @ NCMP a few years ago.

[bblocker68]

By spending a lot of time on this board, one might sometimes get the impression that Ed Carpenter is the second coming of Ayrton Senna.

Close. He's the second coming of Buddy Lazier.

[christcc2]

Great american drivers from the past IRL:

Jack Miller, Scott Harrington, Buzz Calkins, Mike Groff, Johnny Parsons, Paul Durant, Joe Gosek, Billy Boat, Dan Drinan, Stan Wattles, Davy Jones, Lyn St. James, Johnny O' Conell (I still remember his big crash at Vegas 96), Jim Guthrie..

All we need is great US drivers for Indycar!!

Other than a couple of names...WHO ARE THESE GUYS??? During that same time period you had:

- Bobby Rahal
- Michael Andretti
- Jimmy Vasser
- Bryan Herta
- Al Unser Jr
- Richie Hearn
- Scott Pruett
- Robby Gordon

Then add in:
- Alex Zanardi
- Gil de Farren
- Greg Moore
- Christian Fittipaldi
- Emmo
- Adrian Fernadez
- Mark Blundell
- Dario
- Helio
- Paul Tracy
- Kanaan
- Max Papis

MUCH better drivers (American and foreign), much more talent, and they were driving monsters of cars. There may have been past American drivers in the IRL, but they were not great.

[indyracefan]

I also think it's funny that people ***** about the lack of Americans, yet wanted Danica to go, and don't seem high on other young Americans attempting to race in the sport (see the Shannon MacIntosh thread).

What do you people want?

I think they want known, established American drivers such as Jimmie Johnson, Kyle Busch, Jeff Gordon, Kevin Harvick, Kasey Kahne, etc. For some, to steal another racing series most popular drivers is the only way Indycar will ever be popular & successful.

[RV]

Other than a couple of names...WHO ARE THESE GUYS??? During that same time period you had:

- Bobby Rahal
- Michael Andretti
- Jimmy Vasser
- Bryan Herta
- Al Unser Jr
- Richie Hearn
- Scott Pruett
- Robby Gordon

Then add in:
- Alex Zanardi
- Gil de Farren
- Greg Moore
- Christian Fittipaldi
- Emmo
- Adrian Fernadez
- Mark Blundell
- Dario
- Helio
- Paul Tracy
- Kanaan
- Max Papis

MUCH better drivers (American and foreign), much more talent, and they were driving monsters of cars. There may have been past American drivers in the IRL, but they were not great.

Wow! With all those studs, and I'm serious about their ability, what happened to the series?
IndyCar has become glorified club racing. And that started when the boys formed their club.
No American formula car racing series can succeed w/o Indy.
That's my opinion. Show me the error of my ways.

[doitagain]

What does Eddie know?? He can't even put his neck collar on right side up.

So who was faster, him or you?

Who has the most Indy wins / GP points?

[christcc2]

Wow! With all those studs, and I'm serious about their ability, what happened to the series?
IndyCar has become glorified club racing. And that started when the boys formed their club.
No American formula car racing series can succeed w/o Indy.
That's my opinion. Show me the error of my ways.

They sure are succeeding with Indy aren't they.....

[RV]

They sure are succeeding with Indy aren't they.....

Sarcasm or not?

[kartracer23]

So who was faster, him or you?

Who has the most Indy wins / GP points?

.

Seein' as how he drives a shifter & I drive a TaG, Eddie's a bit faster than me. He's a good guy though.

[Dez1013]

Cheever is right, Americans might care to watch if they had a driver they could follow from their home country. It gives you that tie in that helps bring fans. The problem is F1 has always been very elitist and looked down their noses at American drivers. When Americans do get a chance they're usually in bad equipment or asked to be the #2 driver like AJ.

[Josh Knight]

No one produces good quality drivers like Hiro Matsushita any more

[Nigel Red5]

In the context of F1, Cheever is 100% correct. Throw Jimmy Johnson at F1 and see what F1 coverage is like. Honestly try follow ANY international sport in this country through US media and you'll be lucky to grab a 2" square article unless there's some moderately successful American athlete involved.

[BizzyV]

Maybe there would be more americans in F1 if Windsor and who else was involved didn't f up USF1 Team

Hell, even then they couldn't find an American with the talent/money necessary for an F1 ride. Right now the American open wheel drivers on hte european ladder is Rossi, and in Indycar you can take your pick of RHR or Graham, none of which have the chops for an F1 ride.

[Chris Paff]

Same applies to the home series, too - more American drivers would end up with more interest in the series from race fans. But we all know that will not be happening, so..................

Exactly.. Watch out you will be called a xenophobe now..

[Chris Paff]

Besides the fact that Indycar HAS American drivers (Rahal, Andretti, RHR, Kimball, Carpenter, Hildebrand, Newgarden) and 6/7 are pretty good drivers. Bottom line, 7 isnt enough for some of the bitching/moaning fans we have. If we had 10, that wouldnt be enough either. They really wouldnt be happy unless all but a few drivers, if not all, were Americans.

Exactly the series needs to have 20 or more talented Americans if they want to have any chance of being successful in this country..

[Chris Paff]

Wonder if Baseball feels the same way?

Baseball fans mainly root for teams not players.. Once a player leaves their team they no longer support that player.. Same with all team sports.. Racing is totally different..

[Dexter]

When i met Eddie this year in England the 1st thing he said was "Whats wrong with your weather? Since iv'e got here its been dry and sunny and not cold an wet"

Well Look at the last 2 american drivers in F1. Michael Andretti (Not his fault) and Scott "F$$$ing" Speed didn't do much really did they. And Eddie only had 1 stand out year in F1, although he wasn't in the best cars.

Conor Daly, Josef Newgarden these to guys have potential

There is a US driver very well placed to make it to F1, that is Alex Rossi. He has done it the right way, finding backers, going to Europe at a young age, winning races and impressing the right people.

[jandj]

Deleted due to operator error.

[Dexter]

Cheever is right, Americans might care to watch if they had a driver they could follow from their home country. It gives you that tie in that helps bring fans. The problem is F1 has always been very elitist and looked down their noses at American drivers. When Americans do get a chance they're usually in bad equipment or asked to be the #2 driver like AJ.

Wow! I'm not sure where to start with this level of ignorance. The 'always' bit is a good place to start. Here is a list of Americans worshipped and/or highly respected by F1 fans young and old. Phil Hill, Dan Gurney, Richie Ginther, Mario Andretti, Danny Sullivan (yes, Danny Sullivan) and Cheever himself. Then let's throw in Masten Gregory, Pete Revson (a great lost talent), Mark Donohue, George Follmer and you have a rather excellent list of respected US talent.

As for the #2 driver bit, take the example of Rick Mears, Bernie wanted him as a #2 to his World Champion, Nelson Piquet. I'd say that was a reasonable request. Mears himself decided not to go to F1 to be a small fish in a big pond (his own words) so he chose not to test himself against the very best. How is that F1's fault?

So what was your point again?

[Nigel Red5]

There is a US driver very well placed to make it to F1, that is Alex Rossi. He has done it the right way, finding backers, going to Europe at a young age, winning races and impressing the right people.

and hopefully it wil land him in a top ride or the excuse when he doesn't win immediately will be that he's American and will loose his ride to yet another mediocre Spaniard or German with money.... In Europe, if you want to race, you bring money or a sponsor, one way or another. American racing USED to be based on talent, but that's decreasingly the case, even in NASCAR.

[Grinder-Tank]

In Formula One, if a given country has ONE driver in the series, they will be behind them and support the series. Formula One does well in countries that don't have home grown participants.

Unfortunately, in parts of the USA, some won't watch unless the whole or most of the field is USA drivers. I imagine that most of these are fans who follow NASCAR and refuse to watch the NBA.

[Chris Paff]

Unfortunately, in parts of the USA, some won't watch unless the whole or most of the field is USA drivers. I imagine that most of these are fans who follow NASCAR and refuse to watch the NBA.

Once again team sports are totally different then Auto Racing..

[MoparsRule]

And on a related note...

[Scuff]

I'm not sure the series needs a great number of Americans to become more interesting as much as it needs one or two young Americans who can compete with and defeat the best open wheel drivers in the series (who happen to be of other nationalities).