Barber Rating

[TimmyZ1]

Just wanted to make a point before this thread became irrelevant. Jenna Fryer this morning (who also happens to be in LB this weekend) just tweeted the NHL did a .44 for opening night playoff game between the Flyers and the Penguins. I know a helluva of alot more hockey fans than I know race car fans and this is in a football mad town of Cleveland. I truly don't think these craptastic ratings are all on "the product" or "lack of American drivers" or "lack of ovals". 2/3rds of our series is on a small national network and I'm sorry but its hurting us.

I realize the importance of ratings to sponsors with that being said this rush to trash the product, drivers, series, and CEO when these ratings come out is ridiculous if quality play off hockey is in the same ballpark ratings wise.

[OWFANatic]

Just wanted to make a point before this thread became irrelevant. Jenna Fryer this morning (who also happens to be in LB this weekend) just tweeted the NHL did a .44 for opening night playoff game between the Flyers and the Penguins. I know a helluva of alot more hockey fans than I know race car fans and this is in a football mad town of Cleveland. I truly don't think these craptastic ratings are all on "the product" or "lack of American drivers" or "lack of ovals". 2/3rds of our series is on a small national network and I'm sorry but its hurting us.

I realize the importance of ratings to sponsors with that being said this rush to trash the product, drivers, series, and CEO when these ratings come out is ridiculous if quality play off hockey is in the same ballpark ratings wise.

We've actually been over this ground before. The ratings on NBCSN for NHL playoff hockey are not comparable to Indycar broadcasts. The local markets, where the vast, vast majority of the viewership is, isn't watching their playoff games on NBCSN. In Pittsburgh, they're watching their games on ROOTSports. In Philly, their watching the games on Comcast Sportsnet Philly. As such, the ratings on NBCSN exclude the viewership in the home markets. It's the same for the other NHL markets.

[use2know]

Just wanted to make a point before this thread became irrelevant. Jenna Fryer this morning (who also happens to be in LB this weekend) just tweeted the NHL did a .44 for opening night playoff game between the Flyers and the Penguins. I know a helluva of alot more hockey fans than I know race car fans and this is in a football mad town of Cleveland. I truly don't think these craptastic ratings are all on "the product" or "lack of American drivers" or "lack of ovals". 2/3rds of our series is on a small national network and I'm sorry but its hurting us.

I realize the importance of ratings to sponsors with that being said this rush to trash the product, drivers, series, and CEO when these ratings come out is ridiculous if quality play off hockey is in the same ballpark ratings wise.

The NHL Opening Night numbers on NBCSN and CNBC reflect noteworthy growth...:

• The most-watched NHL playoff opening night ever for the NBC Sports Network (formerly VERSUS).
• A 29% average rating increase on NBC Sports Network vs. last year’s opening night.
• A 12% average rating increase for all three games on NBC Sports Network and CNBC compared to last year’s opening night.
• The most-watched opening night playoff game in NBC Sports Network history and the most-watched opening night playoff game in 10 years for Flyers-Penguins, won 4-3 in overtime by Philadelphia, who overcame a 3-0 deficit.

And this is with all NBC Sports Network, CNBC and NHL Network first-round playoff games being blacked out in local markets.

Those are some noteworthy bullet points.

[TimmyZ1]

I'm sorry but a .44 is still **** no matter how you cut it. Just like our .25 is

[Chris Paff]

We've actually been over this ground before. The ratings on NBCSN for NHL playoff hockey are not comparable to Indycar broadcasts. The local markets, where the vast, vast majority of the viewership is, isn't watching their playoff games on NBCSN. In Pittsburgh, they're watching their games on ROOTSports. In Philly, their watching the games on Comcast Sportsnet Philly. As such, the ratings on NBCSN exclude the viewership in the home markets. It's the same for the other NHL markets.

Agreed, everytime the Capitals are on NBC Sports Network its blacked out here locally..

[OWFANatic]

I'm sorry but a .44 is still **** no matter how you cut it. Just like our .25 is

As long as you agree that it would be like looking at the national ratings for a Pacers vs Detroit NBA game, without being able to include the viewership in either the Indianapolis and Detroit DMAs, then sure, it's exactly the same.

[Todd Gack]

I truly don't think these craptastic ratings are all on "the product" or "lack of American drivers" or "lack of ovals". 2/3rds of our series is on a small national network and I'm sorry but its hurting us.

How do you explain the craptastic Indy Car ratings on ABC then? Or the continued terrible (compared to where they used to be) ratings for the Indy 500? Just dumb luck?

I think even the Amish get ABC.

[Todd Gack]

I guess RR fans are looking elsewhere than IndyCars for their RR fix.

Yes, all 9 of them.

[porscheman]

Network is the answer. How you get there full time? That's a different question. It's a shame too, NBCSN does a fine job with the broadcast but, ain't no one there to appreciate it. Only the ALMS has a worse TV package than INDYCAR.

[BrakeEarly]

I truly don't think these craptastic ratings are all on "the product" or "lack of American drivers" or "lack of ovals". 2/3rds of our series is on a small national network and I'm sorry but its hurting us.

Did JFK die because the car ran into LHO's bullet, or because LHO's bullet slammed into him?

2/3rds of the series is on that small network because the series had craptastic ratings that were difficult to distinguish from the noise that an infomercial draws in ratings except that there were concentrations of viewers around Indianapolis and the location of the events.

The ratings stink on network, but the network comes with more viewers. If you can't increase the ratings above what the infomercials draw then either you pay the same way they do, or you move to a crappier channel on cable, don't pay anything (don't make anything either), and you have fewer viewers because the channel doesn't have it's own viewership built in.

It absolutely is all on the product (driver demographic and track type are part of the product regardless of whether or not those characteristics have a meaningful impact on mass audience captivation). The series is on NBC/Versus because it did not have a product that interested television fans enough to make them watch in meaningful numbers. The series could get back to network if it could move the dial in any meaningful way during the opportunities it has during the events it does put on ABC.

[TimmyZ1]

How do you explain the craptastic Indy Car ratings on ABC then? Or the continued terrible (compared to where they used to be) ratings for the Indy 500? Just dumb luck?

I think even the Amish get ABC.

Honestly there just not going anywhere. They've floated on ABC from .8 to 1.2 and some change for it seems like the last few years. If we saw a .5 or .4 for St. Pete I'd be worried but its int he same range its always been. There not great obviously but there not a dramatic drop compared over a few years.

Did JFK die because the car ran into LHO's bullet, or because LHO's bullet slammed into him?

2/3rds of the series is on that small network because the series had craptastic ratings that were difficult to distinguish from the noise that an infomercial draws in ratings except that there were concentrations of viewers around Indianapolis and the location of the events.

The ratings stink on network, but the network comes with more viewers. If you can't increase the ratings above what the infomercials draw then either you pay the same way they do, or you move to a crappier channel on cable, don't pay anything (don't make anything either), and you have fewer viewers because the channel doesn't have it's own viewership built in.

It absolutely is all on the product (driver demographic and track type are part of the product regardless of whether or not those characteristics have a meaningful impact on mass audience captivation). The series is on NBC/Versus because it did not have a product that interested television fans enough to make them watch in meaningful numbers. The series could get back to network if it could move the dial in any meaningful way during the opportunities it has during the events it does put on ABC.

And a massive split which took Indycar type racing out of the public other than once a year for 12 years had nothing to do with it correct?

[Todd Gack]

And a massive split which took Indycar type racing out of the public other than once a year for 12 years had nothing to do with it correct?

"The Split" is long over. Its been 5 years, Tim.

That excuse has to die. People don't watch the Indy Car Series anymore for a bunch of legit reasons. The IRL/Champ Car stuff has nothing anymore to do with it.

Its a bad product. Simple as that. From having way too many foreign-born drivers. To racing on terrible race tracks that are horrible presentations on TV. To too many inane rules that confuse even the staunchest of supporters. To the perception that this is AAA racing, with a bunch of drivers who either weren't good enough for Formula 1 or not good enough for NASCAR.

Enough with blaming "the split" or Tony George. This isn't 2007 anymore.

[TimmyZ1]

"The Split" is long over. Its been 5 years, Tim.

That excuse has to die. People don't watch the Indy Car Series anymore for a bunch of legit reasons. The IRL/Champ Car stuff has nothing anymore to do with it.

Its a bad product. Simple as that. From having way too many foreign-born drivers. To racing on terrible race tracks that are horrible presentations on TV. To too many inane rules that confuse even the staunchest of supporters. To the perception that this is AAA racing, with a bunch of drivers who either weren't good enough for Formula 1 or not good enough for NASCAR.

Enough with blaming "the split" or Tony George. This isn't 2007 anymore.

Were venturing into "beating the dead horse" area but at the end of the day the split absolutely completely hammered this sport. Nobody won period. And your not going to get any form of majority popularity back in 5 years. Especially since the first 2 years after the unification weren't handled the best way. From MMA to NASCAR none of them were built overnight. Nor will the ICS.

The rest of your statement (AAA perception, terrible product and tracks) are opinions you've stated in the past and while I feel strongly their wrong you are entitled to them.

[Billy Chin]

"The Split" is long over. Its been 5 years, Tim.

That excuse has to die. People don't watch the Indy Car Series anymore for a bunch of legit reasons. The IRL/Champ Car stuff has nothing anymore to do with it.

Its a bad product. Simple as that. From having way too many foreign-born drivers. To racing on terrible race tracks that are horrible presentations on TV. To too many inane rules that confuse even the staunchest of supporters. To the perception that this is AAA racing, with a bunch of drivers who either weren't good enough for Formula 1 or not good enough for NASCAR.

Enough with blaming "the split" or Tony George. This isn't 2007 anymore.

I agree. The excuses have to end. Everyone knows TG was a disaster who had no business running anything, let alone Indycar. No one argues otherwise. But the product needs to be fixed for the series to have a chance to survive, let alone thrive.

[Turn13]

Its a bad product. Simple as that.

What would improve it? How would you get the drivers or the tracks you want?

...the product needs to be fixed for the series to have a chance to survive, let alone thrive.

What do you recommend?

Do you agree with Todd that changing drivers and tracks as Todd suggests is the key is the key? How would you make that happen?