Here's a pretty civil forum dealing with controversial subjects:
http://www.alpb.org/forum/index.php?board=8.0
Here's a pretty civil forum dealing with controversial subjects:
http://www.alpb.org/forum/index.php?board=8.0
"The series may be hesitant to say it, but the day is here for everybody that loves IndyCar racing to link arms and help each other out. Anybody who doesn’t want to do that needs to find something else to do with their time.”
-- Eddie Gossage, President, Texas Motor Speedway, ICONIC Advisory Committee & TrackForum member
No...but, it is a place where people can debate issues...obviously numbers don't make for a great forum otherwise CE would still be open...Originally Posted by comfortably numb
The trick is balancing quantity with quality, of course.
CE is open for a test group of participants. It will be available soon for other members.
Am I too assume that I'm not among the chosen few as my browser doesn't list it...
That's the conclusion I came to as well...
"The number of threads by one poster in the OT is getting a little out of hand, IMHO. "
"In the land of freedom we are held hostage by the tyranny of political correctness...If we speak..we say it the wrong way; if we do not speak we are cowards…."
[QUOTE=doitagain;2980560]The trick is balancing quantity with quality, of course.
CE is open for a test group of participants. It will be available soon for other members.[/QUOTE
Think it would be a mistake, you'll be back to violations and suspensions within a week.
"Moralism is often the first strength of a weak mind"
-Norman Mailer-
So, in 10 yrs., I've been on 3-4 racing forums- here, 7G, OC, and, briefly, SpudNut. The 7G to OC example seems relevant, if not instructive, here. 7G had a politics/OT forum. For awhile, it was interesting and civil, though tilted somewhat left in this case (perhaps why, as a lib. myself, I enjoyed it, at first). Upon reflection, though, no matter how thoughtful it may have been, by the end, it became an insane asylum on all sides. Poor Anita (the mod.) couldn't keep up.
Eventually, the whole site went away, and many of us 7gers migrated to OffCamber. OC, from it's creation, was an explicitly NO POLITICS board. Many of us who came over initially challenged this, esp. since it was 2004, a political yr. But it wasn't our place, so we had no right to overturn it.
For OC, it's worked out well. I think it's vital that, from day one of it's '03 launch, it banned politics, so other than us interlopers, it was never an issue. Here, though, we've always had political discussion. Banning it now might be tough.
Further, one problem OC faces is drawing the line between interesting discussion and politics. For discussions on the US auto industry, "Arab Spring," etc., this is thorny to navigate. That said, most members can now self-police on this b/c we/they know what's expected.
Now, OC is a much smaller community than TF. Post-unification, even moreso. OT, but I'm still a member there, even though my racing views today are not terribly sympatico w/ most members.
Point is, smaller communities are easier to police, but they're... smaller. Take CE away here, and will "lurkers," who come mostly for that be gone? Would that be good, bad, or neutral?
My thought: Ban it in principle, though give some leeway on SELECT OT topics. A thread started for politics? Gone. One that evolves into a political ELEMENT, though not the entirety of it? See where it goes.
"Many people always ask me why I sign off 'Until we meet again.' Because goodbye is so final.
Goodbye, Dan Wheldon."
Marty Reid, Oct. 16, 2011
Not sure the OC / 7G comparison is valid, though, since as I understand it 7G was basically unmoderated for a period of time there at the end. It wasn't that she couldn't keep up, so much as she couldn't access the site at all. Plus, has OC ever had the volume of membership or activity that 7G had?
Someone else may correct me if I'm wrong.
I suspect what we end up with will be a good solution for most
The VERY END of 7g is... murky, but months before, w/ moderation, it was getting bad at times. Topics were axed, people suspended, etc., mostly on the OT side.Not sure the OC / 7G comparison is valid, though, since as I understand it 7G was basically unmoderated for a period of time there at the end. It wasn't that she couldn't keep up, so much as she couldn't access the site at all. Plus, has OC ever had the volume of membership or activity that 7G had?
Someone else may correct me if I'm wrong.
I suspect what we end up with will be a good solution for most
OC was/is always meant to be a smaller community. I'd guess on the unification rumors/stories/finality, it had a high volume. Otherwise, 7G had more. Point is, small or not, the no politics worked really well for it.
I'm a member of a boating forum that banned political, religious and other controversial subjects in 2007. That site has about 333,000 members now and probably had over 250,000 at that time. Obviously most don't participate a whole lot. The political threads were dominating the OT forum were about as ugly as they could get. Probably about 40 or 50 posters dominated the forum.So, in 10 yrs., I've been on 3-4 racing forums- here, 7G, OC, and, briefly, SpudNut. The 7G to OC example seems relevant, if not instructive, here. 7G had a politics/OT forum. For awhile, it was interesting and civil, though tilted somewhat left in this case (perhaps why, as a lib. myself, I enjoyed it, at first). Upon reflection, though, no matter how thoughtful it may have been, by the end, it became an insane asylum on all sides. Poor Anita (the mod.) couldn't keep up.
Eventually, the whole site went away, and many of us 7gers migrated to OffCamber. OC, from it's creation, was an explicitly NO POLITICS board. Many of us who came over initially challenged this, esp. since it was 2004, a political yr. But it wasn't our place, so we had no right to overturn it.
For OC, it's worked out well. I think it's vital that, from day one of it's '03 launch, it banned politics, so other than us interlopers
Further, one problem OC faces is drawing the line between interesting discussion and politics. For discussions on the US auto industry, "Arab Spring," etc., this is thorny to navigate. That said, most members can now self-police on this b/c we/they know what's expected.
Now, OC is a much smaller community than TF. Post-unification, even moreso. OT, but I'm still a member there, even though my racing views today are not terribly sympatico w/ most members.
Point is, smaller communities are easier to police, but they're... smaller. Take CE away here, and will "lurkers," who come mostly for that be gone? Would that be good, bad, or neutral?
My thought: Ban it in principle, though give some leeway on SELECT OT topics. A thread started for politics? Gone. One that evolves into a political ELEMENT, though not the entirety of it? See where it goes.
The website owners are in the business of selling boating supplies and equipment and decided they no longer wanted this as part of their image. The moderators were given the instruction, clean it up if you can, shut it down if you can't. It took some heavy moderator work but they eliminated banned subjects and the OT forum still exists. Those few who couldn't live without politics moved on. Downside is it takes a lot of work by a lot of moderators.
I'm on several other forums where politics have been forbidden from the outset. My experience is that if politics are allowed, a lot of the threads will go ugly at some point and the banhammer will have to be swung. Just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Politics and religion, not counting sex, are the two most popular subjects in history...trying to avoid them is simply inane...
And porn is the most popular subject in the history of the Internet.
Their popularity as subjects doesn't mean that they should be part of a racing forum.
Moments of absolute clarity sometimes happen.I wondered what happened to the CE forum. I used to post fairly consistently there but stopped about a couple months ago. I will try to stay away from the new one as well.
43 -- Joe Gosek -- ALTA Team Scandia -- Lola/Ford
So, those of us posting here in Feedback are among the unchoosen. That is unfair.My rights are being violated.
Looking forward to the CE forum being back on line.
After years of fighting and a split, guess what, we are all IndyCar
October will always be a sad racing month for me. RIP Greg and Dan. You both were great and we miss you.
We are the disenfranchised.So, those of us posting here in Feedback are among the unchoosen. That is unfair.
"Is that my *** that I smell burning?" ... Helmet Stogie from "Death spasms of the Mabuchi"
Was it somewhere else in the interim?So, those of us posting here in Feedback are among the unchoosen. That is unfair.
Looking forward to the CE forum being back on line.
Dad use to say something when we would ask for something that wasn't good for us... Like Ice Cream after 8.
"Let's Don't but Say We Did..."
"Ride The Barrel & Get Pitted... So Pitted."
Thanks for the link. It looks promising.
Sifaka
Very interesting:
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I like Doc's suggestion.
Last edited by ventman; 04-11-2012 at 02:42 PM. Reason: edit: if you want to step off the cliff, try this one: www.politicalforum.com
All rides are bought. But occasionally the currency is talent.
I found Waldo!
What do I win?
My fear is that the Off Topics forum will become overrun and usurped as the new Current Events forum. I hope that does not happen, but I fear that it will (with the Zimmermann thread being the first step in that direction).
Lose the mega-downforce and let's separate the men from the boys!
I have absolutely no fear of that happening.
The OT is a cool forum for interesting unconventional fun mostly light-hearted topics. I don't want to see it polluted by partisan bickering about politics and economics.
+1
Cancer sucks.
Some good ones on there. I like the name: cAPSLOCK,
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Brian's Wish
If the members who knew and understood the rules about arguing with the point and not the person could be empowered to help moderate, things might be better. They could be empowered by signing a user agreement, then getting an additional feature such as an additional "report this post" kind of icon. Or they could be empowered to actually moderate by invoking the "LOSER" ruling on a post that crossed the line. Perhaps their first several rulings could be reviewed by the real mods to ensure they are moderating properly.
There is another kind of post that I think should be "LOSERED." It is not prohibited by the rules, but perhaps could be. This is the "Trackforummed" post that is just often a pointless denigration of an idea or news bit, without anything contributed along with it. That is pretty pointless and should also get the "LOSER" treatment.
And in addition to the big red LOSER, the background could be made darker or something, so people scanning will know to just skip right over it.
The user agreement is all about promising not to overdo the capability.
Dick Ralstin - Barney Oldfield - AJ Foyt - Jim Clark - Dan Gurney - IMS - IMS YT - INDYCAR - INDYCAR YT
I HATED when my dad would say that!
OC was smart to avoid politics, it made the community side peaceful and close knit.So, in 10 yrs., I've been on 3-4 racing forums- here, 7G, OC, and, briefly, SpudNut. The 7G to OC example seems relevant, if not instructive, here. 7G had a politics/OT forum. For awhile, it was interesting and civil, though tilted somewhat left in this case (perhaps why, as a lib. myself, I enjoyed it, at first). Upon reflection, though, no matter how thoughtful it may have been, by the end, it became an insane asylum on all sides. Poor Anita (the mod.) couldn't keep up.
Eventually, the whole site went away, and many of us 7gers migrated to OffCamber. OC, from it's creation, was an explicitly NO POLITICS board. Many of us who came over initially challenged this, esp. since it was 2004, a political yr. But it wasn't our place, so we had no right to overturn it.
For OC, it's worked out well. I think it's vital that, from day one of it's '03 launch, it banned politics, so other than us interlopers
Further, one problem OC faces is drawing the line between interesting discussion and politics. For discussions on the US auto industry, "Arab Spring," etc., this is thorny to navigate. That said, most members can now self-police on this b/c we/they know what's expected.
Now, OC is a much smaller community than TF. Post-unification, even moreso. OT, but I'm still a member there, even though my racing views today are not terribly sympatico w/ most members.
Point is, smaller communities are easier to police, but they're... smaller. Take CE away here, and will "lurkers," who come mostly for that be gone? Would that be good, bad, or neutral?
My thought: Ban it in principle, though give some leeway on SELECT OT topics. A thread started for politics? Gone. One that evolves into a political ELEMENT, though not the entirety of it? See where it goes.
TF's CE site has always been a poor reflection (IMHO) of TF.
I believe it divides the fan base. The reality is that TF is Indy Car's #1 fan site. Why bother have have a forum that is a poor reflection of the fan base?
It would be interesting to know what the lock thread, post removal count is on all the forums and how they compare.
Personally speaking I think they should have a link to a non TF site and let them play in that puddle of muck.
“After a month there's a couple of tar balls and a sick bird? I thought this was the worst environmental disaster of all time?.” Wilke
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