2012 NHL Playoffs Thread

[Marc P. Gregoire]

I think getting on the Blues bandwagon for the playoffs might pay off for me.

[comfortably numb]

Some of the cheap shots I have seen don't deserve suspensions, they should be charged with assault. Too much dirty play is going on and the refs and the league need to shut it down,

Agreed, but it will never happen.
Hockey is going the opposite direction of other sports.
I did not grow up where it was played, but the legalized mayhem has kept me from being a fan.

[KevMcNJ]

KevMcNJ, home announcers are usually pretty much homers by definition. The guy who did not fit that (IMO) was the late, great Gene Hart. Yes, he was an integral part of the BSB days and beyond, but he was solid and superb behind the mic. His daughter Lauren is the one who often sings the anthem at home games and does the live/tape "duet" of God Bless America with Kate Smith. Gene will always be Flyers hockey for me.

Just seems like the homers the Flyers find to do the play by play do it with a little more gusto. Playing to their audience of course. I am old enough to remember Gene Hart but cannot comment on his skills. I just remember he was a large feller. I hate the Flyers with a blinding rage but the Lauren Hart/Kate Smith "duet" is a Goosebump Moment every time they pull it out. And its become a small but important part of hockey tradition right along side the Octopus in detroit and playing organ music during downtime.

Well, that's enough... If you think any of the Philly folks are tough on the Pens, read this from one of the Pittsburgh writers.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_791501.html

This series has been a melt down of legendary proportions. they will still be talking about the 2o12 Penguins embarrassing playoff KO when Crosby is bouncing grandchildren on his knee

[3-wide]

Hockey is going the opposite direction of other sports. I did not grow up where it was played, but the legalized mayhem has kept me from being a fan.

I'm a big NHL fan, but I fear that the "legalized mayhem", as much as it is loved by millions, will only end when someone is severely hurt. I know it has never happened, but something tells me they're on borrowed time. All it will take is one solid punch, reminiscent of Kermit Washington's punch that essentially ended Rudy Tomjanovich's career. (Later the subject of a book by John Feinstein - "The Punch: One Night, Two Lives, and the Fight That Changed Basketball Forever." jmho

[Marc P. Gregoire]

Hockey is probably less violent now than it has been at any time in its history, and the violence peaked in the 70s and 80s.

[PHJIndy]

Hockey is probably less violent now than it has been at any time in its history, and the violence peaked in the 70s and 80s.

I agree. The Broadstreet Bullies of the 70's were a lot more violent. But then again there was less stick swinging in those days, fighting was man to man.

[akh_v2.0]

Not that we're having the flame war here that I've seen on Yahoo!, Flyer and Pens blogs...but TSN.ca had a good column from former NHL ref Kerry Fraser that looked at the Game 3 histrionics in a pretty neutral way. An interesting read for those of us obsessed... Waiting aniously to see what Shanbans come out of today's hearings.

http://www.tsn.ca/blogs/kerry_fraser...46#YourCallTop

[Slim]

Neal has met with Shanny but no verdict yet...Asham meets with him tonight. I guess we'll know more tomorrow morning.

[mclarke]

The intensity of the Pittsburgh/ Philadelphia series is leading to a great many confrontations among the players but the coverage by and reaction to the games by the media and the fans tend to blow things out of proportion up quite a bit. I agree with Kerry Fraser that the failure on the part of the referees to take control of things in Game 3 when Sidney Crosby twice acted in ways which were sure to infuriate the Flyers probably led to much of the later fighting but that hesitation to deal firmly with star players is the curse of the NHL during this time of year.

The amusing thing is that it isn't the Flyers who are resurrecting the style of the Broad Street Bullies but it is the team of Mario Lemieux, who argued so strongly against fighting and intimidation tactics when he was a player : as such, it is the Penguins who have been saddled with player suspensions for the next game. Bottom line on this series is that the teams didn't like each other going in and the inability of Fleury to stop a beachball combined with the inclination of the season's top scorer to disappear when play becomes physical is what has resulted in Pittsburgh's frustration and in their initiating the fighting.

Fans of hockey know what to expect in the play-offs when teams in a very physical sport confront each other night after night to earn the right to continue on th eroad to the Cup. Injuries which would send participants in other sports to hospital beds tend to be shaken off by hockey players who insist on adhering to the long-standing code of the game; fortunately, concussions are seen as the exception to this rule in todays game and the players will be better off in the long term because of this.

I rarely have concern that someone will get badly hurt in a hockey fight and I find that the approach used in hockey is cleaner and more honest than the attempts to injure which take place in other sports. Polls taken among players invariable lead to almost unanimous support for continuing with the game as it has always been played, i.e. with fighting penalized but permitted, though staged fights should be and likely will be taken out of the game in the near future. I have been watching hockey since the days of the original six when I knew virtually every player on every team and today's games are no more vicious nor dangerous than they were fifty years ago, though the players are bigger and stronger and they wear equipment which lets them take increasing liberties.

Yes, I will be watching game 4 with interest as the Penguins play with desperation and to salvage some pride while the Flyers will try to remember not to take their feet off the Pittsburgh throats.

[KevMcNJ]

I got Detroit/Nashville here in SC tonight. Kind of nice just enjoying a playoff hockey game with no dog in the fight

[Slim]

Blackhawks and Coyotes are on my tv right now....let's drop the puck!

[mclarke]

I got Detroit/Nashville here in SC tonight. Kind of nice just enjoying a playoff hockey game with no dog in the fight

Nice game so far with Rinne holding Detroit at bay. Surprised that Nashville seems to have stopped finishing their checks since that style has been very effective for them so far.

Should be a good third period.

[Marc P. Gregoire]

[akh_v2.0]

Great comeback by Florida, Devils looked to have them down and out.

Marian Hossa was carried off the ice immobilized on a stretcher after being laid out by Raffi Torres. Another leaping hit to the head of a player w/o the puck...with no penalty called.

Bettman and Shanahan need to have every referee read Kerry Fraser's column. The players today are too big, too fast...it's not "old time hockey" any more. I don't want to see players being taken off the ice on stretchers!

[Marc P. Gregoire]

"The only way you should be shocked Raffi Torres crossed the line is if you watched him do it while sticking a metal fork into a wall socket."

[akh_v2.0]

Twitter blowing up that Neal gets one game and Asham 4 games. Don't know if the suspensions carry over to next season or not.

Neal deserved more IMO. Repeat offender, 2 head shots on two players.

[mclarke]

Twitter blowing up that Neal gets one game and Asham 4 games. Don't know if the suspensions carry over to next season or not.

Neal deserved more IMO. Repeat offender, 2 head shots on two players.

I agree that Neal should get more than one game but I fear it is a continuation of the special treatment for " star" players which seems to be the trend, with Shanahan hesitant to remove a top goal scorer from Pittsburgh for a lengthy period of time, though it may well be that one game takes him out of the rest of his team's games anyway.

Torres will probably be suspended for the balance of the play-offs with a possible carryover to next season if the Coyotes don't go much further. Vicious hit on Hossa, though Hossa had turned back against the flow so if Torres had not left his feet, I suspect there would not be any suspension. Since Torres did leave his feet, I fully understand Quenneville's anger that no penalty was called.

[Captain Spyro]

That shot from Torres seriously made me sick. I'm kind of glad I missed all of today's games at this point. *Sigh.*

I agree with Asham's suspension, but Neal got off WAY too easy here. The punishments need to be strong and severe. I love the speed of the game, but right now, the bigger players are just being careless. No excuse.

[akh_v2.0]

I slept on the late news from Shanahan, hoping I'd feel better about it in the morning. I don't... The hit by Neal on Coots could have been exactly like the Hossa hit, if Neal had caught him flush in the jaw like Torres appears to hit Hossa. I actually feel like the NHL may have given Asham too harsh a penalty (still haven't seen if it carries over). But he's a 4th line guy and it's "easy" to suspend him and not one of the few Penguins playing well. I am absolutely incensed that Shanahan appears willing to take Neal at his word that he was "bracing for contact" on the first hit. Greg Wyshynski (Puck Daddy on Yahoo!) has a good blog piece that explains exactly how I feel...

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...024844757.html

This idea of suspending "to the injury" has to stop, and there needs to be more consistency. Perhaps one guy shouldn't be making these decisions, but rather a small group (former player, former coach, former referree, and former GM). Head injuries don't always manifest themselves right away. Light suspensions because there was "no injury" have the potential to blow up in the NHL's face.

[akh_v2.0]

...and for the record, I think this is stupid. But no one will ever accuse the Philadephia Daily News of going for Pulitzer-quality work. They are the WIP of the newspaper business.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...v=3#more-30708

However, I thought this column, while an interesting idea, was too quick to try and "explain" Crosby's actions.

http://www.rawcharge.com/2012/4/16/2...lems-linger-on

[Jamski]

Nice game so far with Rinne holding Detroit at bay. Surprised that Nashville seems to have stopped finishing their checks since that style has been very effective for them so far.

Should be a good third period.

And it was, too!

[Frank Capua]

Hockey is probably less violent now than it has been at any time in its history, and the violence peaked in the 70s and 80s.

We weren't watching in the 70s either. However it appears to me that the advantage that Hockey has over Soccer in America is that kids who grow up playing hockey keep watching hockey after their playing days are over. Soccer doesn't hold the kid's interest any longer than it does for their parents.

Violence is also way down in the NFL compared to the 70s and 80s but get's 10 times the attention it used to. It's the times, they went and changed on us just like Dylan warned us that they would.

I just wished Bob had warned us about facebook and the Kardashians.

[fasteddy]

I think I have lost all interest in hockey. This year's cup winner may be the team able to suit up six healthy players.

[BADGER]

Hockey is probably less violent now than it has been at any time in its history, and the violence peaked in the 70s and 80s.

Bull, they have handed out more suspensions in the first round then they did in the entire playoffs last year. Was it worse in the 70s, yes, but it is worse this year than it has been for quite a while.

[BADGER]

I agree that Neal should get more than one game but I fear it is a continuation of the special treatment for " star" players which seems to be the trend, with Shanahan hesitant to remove a top goal scorer from Pittsburgh for a lengthy period of time, though it may well be that one game takes him out of the rest of his team's games anyway.

Torres will probably be suspended for the balance of the play-offs with a possible carryover to next season if the Coyotes don't go much further. Vicious hit on Hossa, though Hossa had turned back against the flow so if Torres had not left his feet, I suspect there would not be any suspension. Since Torres did leave his feet, I fully understand Quenneville's anger that no penalty was called.

What about the fact that Hossa didn't have the puck within 10 ft of him? The NHL needs to address the hits on guys without the puck. This was my same gripe when Cambell was layed out by Ovechkin a few years ago. He had passed the puck and was hit a few seconds after the puck was gone.

[Slim]

NEW YORK -- Phoenix Coyotes forward Raffi Torres has been suspended indefinitely, pending an in-person hearing Friday, April 20, the National Hockey League's Department of Player Safety announced today. The hearing, which had been planned for today, was deferred at the request of the player and the National Hockey League Players' Association.

The hearing will be convened at the NHL's New York office for a hit Torres delivered to Chicago forward Marian Hossa 12:42 into the first period of Game 3 of the teams' Western Conference Quarterfinal series in Chicago on Tuesday, April 17.

They had me at "suspended indefinitely...I hope they suspend him for the remainder of the playoffs...

[mclarke]

What about the fact that Hossa didn't have the puck within 10 ft of him? The NHL needs to address the hits on guys without the puck. This was my same gripe when Cambell was layed out by Ovechkin a few years ago. He had passed the puck and was hit a few seconds after the puck was gone.

The hit took place .8 seconds after Hossa had passed the puck. The league uses .5 seconds as the definition of what constitutes a late hit so the charge by Torres does fall within that definition but is not so far outside the acceptable limits as to be seen as an egregious infraction. As I noted, if Torres hadn't left his feet, I don't think the hit was so late that it would have resulted in a penalty. Any hit such as you described, which that takes place seconds after a pass is made, would definitely be seen as a very late hit.

Besides the timing, the facts that Torres left his feet, that Hossa is the Rangers' top scorer and isn't an overly physical player, and that Torres has been down this road before means that his suspension will raise the bar for the rest of the playoffs.

And I agree with Marc that hockey is less violent today than it has ever been. What is different is that there is a new sheriff in town this year and we have the Pennsylvania shootout which is drawing a lot of attention because of the failure of the the team which switched their white hats for black, the Penguins. Other than that, it's mostly just intense and very enjoyable hockey.

[akh_v2.0]

...snipped...And I agree with Marc that hockey is less violent today than it has ever been. What is different is that there is a new sheriff in town this year and we have the Pennsylvania shootout which is drawing a lot of attention because of the failure of the the team which switched their white hats for black, the Penguins. Other than that, it's mostly just intense and very enjoyable hockey.

I'm not sure how to react to the less/more violent point. Certainly, back in the day of the Broad Street Bullies and beyond, every team had one or more tough guys. Players like Dave Schultz, Dave Semenko, Donald Brashear, Tie Domi, Bob Probert, Tony Twist...they made their living being ready to drop the gloves anytime, anywhere. As the game gradually phased out the goon squads, stickwork went up and the nastiness just took a different path. With the advent of the 2 ref system, violence SHOULD have gone down, and in theory the refs and linesman working in the Cup playoffs should be the best the league has. But instead, we have the mess that is the 2012 First Round. While the Flyers-Pens series, Game 3 in particular, seems like Ground Zero...there have been antics and incidents in almost every single series. Just look at all the suspensions/hearings (and I probably missed a couple).

Kings-Canucks: Bitz
Blues-Sharks: Burns
Coyotes-Blackhawks: Torres, Shaw
Predators-Red Wings: Weber
Rangers-Senators: Hagelin, Carkner
Bruins-Capitals: Backstrom
Panthers-Devils: slackers...
Flyers-Penguins: Adams, Neal, Asham,

Yes, it has been intense and enjoyable, the Stanley Cup playoffs are always that... However, the size, strength, and speed of the players has increased and the rinks are the same size. The ice is more crowded and emotions run high this time of year. Why is it that some of the best skill is ehibited when the teams have to play 4 on 4? they have the room to move, it's hard to have a 4-5 person scrum along the boards when there are only 8 players in the ice. I don't want to see fighting or hard, physical play taken out of the NHL, but the players have to show more respect for one another, the teams have to be held accountable, and the refereeing/discipline has to be more consistent. Slapshot was a fun movie, but this is real life and the NHL can (and has to) do better.

[KevMcNJ]

The viloent acts may be down. Heck they are down. When was the last time you saw NHL players empty the benches or brawling with fans in the stands?

But when the big time goonery was going on 25-35 years ago they were all middle sized farm boys who would have been too small for the JV football team and who drank cases of beer on off nights and had an open pack of Marlboros in their locker.

Theres a good show on Youtube about the Broad St Bullies and theres video of Dave Schultz sitting at his locker puffing on a cigarette as he gets undressed after a game

They are well conditioned monsters now. I think part of the problem may be the higher speeds and larger mass of the players.

And the helmets. I think they all played with a little more respect in the days when no one wore a helmet.

[AHLEditor]

Warning: Chris Lee is scheduled to be tonight's referee in the Flyers-Penguins game.

How good is he?

Here's a hint at what the NHL itself thinks about his talents - he's been in the league since 2000-01 and this is only his fifth playoff game in his career. Think about that for a second.

I really can't explain the logic on this one after the last game.....